Week 3    Day 4

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A Pleasant Discussion

CL 330. I once heard a pleasant discussion among men. It was about the female sex, whether any woman can love her man if she constantly loves her own beauty, that is, if she loves herself on account of her appearance. They agreed among themselves, first that women have a twofold beauty, one natural which is of the face and body, and another spiritual which is of love and manners. They also agreed that the two kinds of beauty are quite often divided in the natural world and that they are always united in the spiritual world, for in the spiritual world, beauty is the form of love and manners, and therefore after death it very often occurs that deformed women become beauties and beautiful women become deformed.

[2] While the men were discussing this, some wives came and said, “Let us join you, because with you, what you are discussing knowledge teaches you, while experience teaches it to us. And also, you know so little about the love of wives that it is scarcely anything. Do you know that it is the prudence of the wisdom of wives to conceal their love for their husbands in the inmost of their breast, or in the middle of their heart?”

The discussion began and the first conclusion by the men was that every woman wishes to appear beautiful in face and beautiful in manners because she is born an affection of love, and beauty is the form of this affection. Therefore, a woman who does not desire to be beautiful is not a woman who wishes to love and be loved, and so is not truly a woman.”

To this the wives said, “A woman’s beauty dwells in soft tenderness, and therefore in exquisite sensation. From this is the love of woman for man, and the love of man for woman. Perhaps you do not understand this?”

[3] The second conclusion of the men was that a woman before marriage wishes to be beautiful for men, but after marriage, if she is chaste, only for only one man and not for men.

To this the wives said, “After a husband has tasted the natural beauty of the wife, he no longer sees it, but sees her spiritual beauty and from this he returns her love; and he recalls her natural beauty, but under a different aspect.”

[4] The third conclusion from their discussion was that if a woman after marriage desires to appear beautiful in the same way as before, she loves men and not [one] man, because a woman loving herself for her own beauty continually wishes to have her beauty tasted. “And since her beauty no longer appears to [her] man, as you have said, she wishes to have it tasted by men before whom it does appear. It is clear that she has the love of the sex, and not the love of one of the sex.”

At this the wives were silent, but murmured these words, “What woman is so free from vanity as not to wish to appear beautiful to men also, at the same time as to her only one?”

Listening to this were some wives from heaven, who were beautiful because they were heavenly affections, and they confirmed the three conclusions of the men. But they added, “Let them love their own beauty and adornments for the sake of their husbands, and from them.”

CL 331. Those three wives, annoyed that the three conclusions of the men had been confirmed by wives from heaven, said to the men, “You have asked whether a woman who loves herself for her own beauty loves her husband. Therefore we in turn will consider whether a man who loves himself for his own intelligence can love his wife. Come and listen.”

And they formed this first conclusion: “No wife loves her man for his face, but for the intelligence in his occupation and in his manners. Know, therefore, that a wife unites herself with the intelligence of the man, and thus with the man. If then a man loves himself for his own intelligence, he draws it back from his wife to himself, which results in disunion and not union. Besides, to love his own intelligence is to be wise from himself, and this is to be insane; therefore, it is to love his own insanity.”

To this the men said, “Perhaps the wife unites herself with the man’s virility.” The wives laughed at this, saying, “A man does not lack virility as long as he loves the wife from intelligence, but he loses it if [he loves] from insanity. Intelligence is to love only the wife, and this love does not lack virility; but it is insanity not to love the wife, but the sex [in general], and this love does lack virility. [Surely] you comprehend this.”

[2] The second conclusion was: “We women are born into the love of the intelligence of men. If then men love their own proprial intelligence, the intelligence cannot be united with its genuine love, which is with the wife. And if the intelligence of the man is not united with its own genuine love, which is with the wife, his intelligence becomes insanity from pride, and conjugial love becomes cold. What woman then can unite her love with cold? And what man can unite the insanity of his pride with the love of intelligence?”

“But,” said the men, “from what does a man have honor from his wife unless he magnifies his own intelligence?” But the wives answered, “From love; for love honors. Honor cannot be separated from love; but love can be from honor.”

[3] Afterwards they came to this third conclusion: “You seem as if you love your wives, and do not see that you are loved by your wives, and thus that you love in return, and that your intelligence is the receiver [of their love]. If then you love your own intelligence within you, that becomes the receiver of your love; and the love of what is one’s own, because it does not tolerate an equal, never becomes conjugial love, but so long as it prevails, it remains scortatory [or licentious].”

At this the men were silent, but murmured, “What is conjugial love?”

Certain husbands in heaven heard these things and thence confirmed the three conclusions of the wives.

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